Gravity sidecar, anyone?

OK - so lets write some rules then. I don't have anywhere to run it yet, except possibly as a demo at a few events next year. However, having mentioned it to a few people while at Belchford last weekend, I'm sure there will be enough interest to get it moving.

So - rules. Starter for 10;

Construction

• Sidecar outfit will have a front wheel, a back wheel and a sidecar wheel.
• The front wheel must steer.
• The rear wheel must be directly behind the front wheel.
• The sidecar wheel may be on the left or the right of the front and rear wheels.
• The spindle of the sidecar wheel must not be further forward than the spindle of the front wheel nor further backwards than the spindle of the rear wheel.
• At least two of the wheels must have its own independent brake system.
• Sidecar outfits are to have the top half of the rear wheel covered on both sides and the inboard side of the sidecar wheel covered over.
• The unladen weight of the sidecar outfit must not exceed 75Kg.

Crew

• Driver must sit astride the line between the front and rear wheels.

Other rules? Dimension limits? Wheel sizes? Fairings allowed?

This is the sort of thing I had in mind. I think gravity sidecar should be based on an existing bike rather than a chassis built from scratch.

 

 

Sorry for the multiple posts.

I'm planning to get my son trained up as ballast. (His mum doesn't know this yet...)

As for the "built on an existing bike" idea, I was thinking that the vehicle ought to take the form of a recognisable bike and sidecar combo, with the bike part at least looking as though it would function as a proper bike should the sidecar be detached (although I'm not proposing that the car should actually be detachable). I thought it would make it less intimidating to newcomers if they could easily see the basis of the vehicle being something that they already have languishing at the back of their shed, rather than the "three wheeled sled" affair similar to the current F1 sidecars (which are not even vaguely motorcycle based).

I'll admit it's just a prejudice though and I'm sure that existing teams would have no trouble building on from scratch using (e.g.) minimoto parts.

Anyway - I'll draft up a set of rules over the weekend and publish them here for comment. In the mean time, check out this video (taken a few years back at Scammonden Dam, on the M62 between Rochdale and Huddersfield).

Rules sound good to me. Think you may need to add the wording Passenger needs to play an active role in the decent. Possably run 2 classes one for BMX based and one for prototype F1 style outfits???????. Im starting my build plans already.

Stephen, Dick & I are keen to have a go - we've already found a BMX bike and Dick's looking for his angle grinder as I write. I have had a quick look at the rules and like what I see. I just wonder whether the brakes at 50kg lateral load would be adequate, bearing in mind the additional weight of a passenger - the all-up weight of the device would be approximately 150% of the weight of an average soapbox and driver combo. Not convinced that driver and passenger should have to wear leathers, as the speeds we will achieve are similar to what I do on a racing pushbike with next to no protection in the event of a spill. I have permanent scars on elbows and knees but can live with them. I do however accept that a decent helmet should be worn I am not sure whether the rules should prevent someone building from scratch or not - as they are drafted I think this is an option and I suspect most people would dabble with a bike conversion anyway to see what works before embarking on anything more complex and expensive. We hope to have something together to play about at Cadwell.

I've just uploaded the second (and, with luck, final) draft of the gravity sidecar rules [clicky for download]. The main changes are;

• Dropped max dry weight to 75Kg.
• Clarified driver and passenger position rules. 
• Clarified rules on fairings, steering and hand holds for the passenger.

Hi there, Paul from B&W Racing here. Yes Mick is right when he says we will be trying to get a sidecar ready as soon as possible. As usual we have lots of (mainly off the wall) ideas but I'd just thought I'd add my 2p to the regulations discussion. My first reaction was to build a device based on the theories of F1 and F2 motorcycle sidecars, check out our friends Barry and Ellie http://www.jjracinguk.com/About%20us/About%20Us.html Yes I know it looks nothing like a motorcycle but thats the way motorcycle sidecars have developed over the years and they perform very well (does help when you have 220+bhp of course) And it appears that other people have gone this route too with their gravity sidecars. The pictures here http://lukaszacek.com/speeddownbozkov/ of people with their noses 3 inches from the ground look awesome. If the regulations that are settled upon pretty much dictate that every gravity sidecar will look like a bmx bike with a tea tray attached to one side will it not look a bit boring? Remember, for those who were at Belchford, we were the daft ones who tried to build a 4 wheel steer cart that weighed more than the Ark Royal - so we like to think 'outside the box' - pun not intended, well actually I think it may have been ;-) Whatever happens, we'll build something that fits the regs but I personally would like to get the COG down as low as possible. But then we've already realized we used the wrong wheels on our cart so I want to make sure we get the right ones for the sidecar and that could well dictate a more 'established' design.

Best check with the organisers first to see if they'll allow it.

My plan is to build a sidecar over winter and have one ready to run next year. I won't be able to get one ready in time for Cadwell as they are insisting on rollbars this year, so I now have to do some major work on the two carties I'm planning to bring down. Wouldn't mind a shot on your sidecar if you get it built though.

I did have one, but I took it off earlier this year. I bust a gut putting one on for Cadwell last year, as I was also going to need one for Belchford. However, there were at least two carties running at Cadwell 08 without any form of roll bar, and one of them actually won the event.

We were discussing standardising the rules and lowering the technical requirements to make it easier for new teams to get involved on the UKGSA forum earlier this year, and one of the suggestions that came up was to re-introduce a rule from the original Goodwood set that would allow carties without rollbars to take part. Belchford adopted this idea, and it was also included in the rules for Cairngorm Soapbox and Border Bogies. I decided then that I wanted to get the Ferret back to the original concept, which was for a low, light and minimalist cartie, so out came the angle grinder and off came the roll bar. It's a real shame that Cadwell hasn't been able to make the same move, but I understand they have to comply with the requirements of the circuit owners. I do think it's a bit OTT though, as Cadwell is about as safe a course as you could possibly want and the speeds involved are not particularly high. Cairngorm, Belchford and Denholm are all longer, and much faster courses.

Mini-moto parts is definately and option. e.g. This one. A lot of the european sidecars use mini moto parts too.I reckon it could work really well.